Sub-Contractors ( Estimated earnings)

astra

Do any members have a proforma sheet/schedule for clients with no books or records to fill in income & expenditure and sign.

ademoore

I haven't, but you could direct them to a free software download like VT Cashbook to enter simple information about incoming/outgoing transactions.

astra

I think you missunderstand, when a client walks in off the street with nothing then earnings & expenditure need to be estimated, hense a sheet with weeky/monthly totals and a declaration to be signed by client.
Sub-Contractors are a good example as they have there earnings fiqure from CIS vouchers but usualy don't keep any record of expenditure, ie fuel,accommadation,tools etc.

Bluewednesday

Then they have to learn to keep receipts if they don't want a big tax bill!!

astra

They have allready paid tax via CIS @ 20%, only a very small amount of subys keep records hense the need for estimated expenditure to retreive a portion of the tax back.

ademoore

Bluewednesday is right, I think clients sometimes need to be reminded that without proper care for their recordkeeping, HMRC can impose large penalties if caught out. A signed declaration only covers your back, but doesnt actually do them any favours.

astra

No matter how much advise and warning you give clients regarding keeping receipts & records there is still a high percentage that ignore the advice and turn up in April/May with nothing, hence the orogional post.

deanshepherd

Astra,

You keep saying that a high proportion of subbies keep no records..

I think you should actually address why a high proportion of your subbies keep no records.

Obtaining estimates as a last resort is all well and good but I would never condone the practice by giving the client a guess sheet to use year on year. Better to encourage them to improve their records.

jilbo

Obtaining estimates as a last resort is all well and good but I would never condone the practice by giving the client a guess sheet to use on year on year. Better to encourage them to improve their records.

Couldn't agree more! Better to train your clients!

groundy

I think you are being harsh on Astra. We are all aware that clients should be educated on the need to keep proper accounting records. However, I also have a proportion of clients ("Subbies") that do not keep any records other than maybe mobile phone bills and invoices for new vans.

Each year I explain the consequences of not keeping accounting records and each year I am given the same explanation that they know what will happen. Unfortunately its a case of their not bothered until it does happen.

With regards to your original post we prepare an income and expenditure account with the same wording that we use on all accounts and we then send a covering letter reminding them that the onus is on them to maintain proper accounting records.

A-Vic

Hi Astra

I had the exact same problem so i suggested and made an expense weekly sheet for them a little bit like a cash book but a lot less complicated - then even get them to attached their recepts to the sheets sounds simple but it works and saves you a lot of hassle.

And no distrispect but i also agree your being harsh on Astra, we also have the same problem with clients and records

ademoore

I certainly never meant any disrespect, namely to astra, but it something I am quite firm with my clients about. Unfortunately it does turn itself around on me, since I now get every receipt under the sun they are trying to put through, so I have to spend time filtering through those that simply cannot be claimed for/justified. :tongue_smilie:

A-Vic

ademoore wrote: »

I certainly never meant any disrespect, namely to astra, but it something I am quite firm with my clients about. Unfortunately it does turn itself around on me, since I now get every receipt under the sun they are trying to put through, so I have to spend time filtering through those that simply cannot be claimed for/justified. :tongue_smilie:

Lol yes the packets of chewing gum and weekly shopping receipts so funny

jilbo

:ohmy: I didn't mean any disrespect either. Maybe I shouldn't come on after a whole bottle of chardonay!! :blushing: I know some clients just can't be trained, my favourites are subsistence claims, receipts from Morrisons containing children's meals

JodieR

hey, i had an anne summers receipt in the middle of a pile the other day - now that's a REALLY well trained client!

A-Vic

JodieR wrote: »

hey, i had an anne summers receipt in the middle of a pile the other day - now that's a REALLY well trained client!

lmao did you include it? make for interesting explantion lol

JodieR

no no, luckily it was folded in half so i didn't see what was on it... i just handed it back and said 'I don't think I can get away with putting that through for you'. He went a little red and very quiet after that! :blushing:

ademoore

heh, one of my clients 'is' an ann summers party area organiser, doing their accounts can be quite enlightening! :blushing:

groundy

JodieR wrote: »

hey, i had an anne summers receipt in the middle of a pile the other day - now that's a REALLY well trained client!

I have a couple of clients with Anne Summers receipts. Both of the them are self employed dancers.