Failed again

Glynis

I have received my audit sim back again as uncompetent and I am absolutely furious.

I have had a major discussion with my tutor who has said that she cannot deem me competent because my answers aren't demonstrating audit knowledge to the questions. What on earth is this suppose to mean
Just exactly what do you have to do to pass this ridiculously impossible sim. My tutor was very vague tonight and I don't think she knows what she is doing as she is new.

Thanks for any help. Rant over!

PGM

I struggled a bit with audit. Its quite an alien subject for someone thats not an auditor, and took longer to learn than I expected. As an accountant I know what needs to be done to check things?! But there is a lot of new concepts to learn.

Can you ask for more info before you start revising over again?

AK002

If the audit sim is troubling you so much why don't you attempt another unit instead?

A-Vic

AK002 wrote: »

If the audit sim is troubling you so much why don't you attempt another unit instead?

true why not go for tax exam at least then it be over and done with

Portsmouth_AAT

Glynis wrote: »

I have received my audit sim back again as uncompetent and I am absolutely furious.

I have had a major discussion with my tutor who has said that she cannot deem me competent because my answers aren't demonstrating audit knowledge to the questions. What on earth is this suppose to mean
Just exactly what do you have to do to pass this ridiculously impossible sim. My tutor was very vague tonight and I don't think she knows what she is doing as she is new.

Thanks for any help. Rant over!

With Audit you need to show an understanding of the Key words and where they come into effect, and how to use them within the simulation, so where u use an example throw in as many key word to back it up!!

Our tutor explained this and it helped me.

taskey

even if you not competent on the sim can you not do extra questions to earn the marks? that is what i am doing for my sim

Tracy

Glynis

My college don't do the cash management unit or tax unit so I am stuck with IAP. I am so fed up with studying for this.

My new tutor is awful she is very young and obviously doesn't have the experience to deal with such papers. I have spoken to her senior about this because I do not know how I could have failed.
They obviously ll stick together because all her senior said was that they have strict marking criteria to follow from AAT and if a paper does not meet that criteria then it is deemed incompetent. But what the hell is the criteria!
I am getting nowere with this and am getting increasingly frustraed with my college tutor.

SandyHood

In response to this quote:

Taskey wrote: »

if you not competent on the sim can you not do extra questions to earn the marks?

One aspect of the skill test/simulation that makes AAT assessment different from a lot of other examining bodies is the need to be near perfect to pass.
If you achieve less than the pass standard in everything, but are between 80% and 100% you can be allowed to complete additional exercises that will bring you up to standard.

Now how this may help you Glynis

The NVQ element of the AAT is about demonstrating competence. Most NVQs are done in the workplace. The skills test is a workplace simulation. If you were planning to send someone out to audit a local business, you'd need to be confident in their ability. You can't just hope, they need to have proven competence. The AAT simulation is that badge of competence.

Typically the inside cover of the skills test/simulation spells out the things a candidate must demonstrate in order to satisfy the competence requirement. Even if your tutor is not going to discuss it, I'm sure she'd let you read the comments she has made based on each task.

A-Vic

Glynis putting myself in your position i would move heaven and earth to complete the last unit in order to complete and if after all the trouble i felt i was still going no further i personally would seek other ways of finishing. i.e. even if it ment having to go to an external training provider, yes expensive but can pay unit by unit so it wouldnt be that much.

Steve Collings

Glynis,

I don't think launching a personal attack on your tutor is the answer to the problem here. If your script is not up to the standards required to be classed as competent then that is hardly the tutors fault and I think reporting her to her superior simply because of this is uncalled for.

Tutors are there to help you and your tutor will undoubtedly recognise that you are struggling with this simulation. I don't think a tuition provider would allow a tutor to teach students a subject they were not specialists in or had experience in (especially a paper at technician level) and allow them to mark simulations.

Without sounding condescending or patronising, I would suggest that you calm down and sit with your tutor to go through exactly why you failed this simulation and take on board the recommendations your tutor makes for you. That's what your tutor is there for.

Good luck anyway.

Steve

NeilH

Steve Collings wrote: »

I don't think a tuition provider would allow a tutor to teach students a subject they were not specialists in or had experience in (especially a paper at technician level) and allow them to mark simulations.

If only that were the case! There are a few "horror" stories on the forums and I have my own (non AAT experiences) as well. As for "reporting" her to her senior, without knowing the full details of the grievance it's impossible to say if that was an appropriate course of action. Again, I've been in this situation on a non AAT course (the majority of the course group were in the “same boat”) and the only way it got resolved was to raise the issue with the course leader. But I digress...

I trained as an NVQ assessor a few years ago and part of the marking process is giving proper feedback to candidates, fail or pass. If the feedback given by a particular tutor is insufficient, then you should explain that you're not "getting it" and need more detail/support. The tutor should be prepared to do this and whilst I’m not saying they should provide the answers or solutions to the assessment, they should go into detail of why you haven't demonstrated competence and what is the requirements are looking for besides just being able to answer the question and calculate the numbers - the term exam technique springs to mind but is not quite appropriate for a sim.

Good luck

Neil

Glynis

The tutor herself has only been at our college for a month so I don't know how she can mark me as fail because she doesn't have any experience of my other simulations. That is the problem I have with her. I don't like her method of teaching despite her "superior" saying she hasn't received any complaints so far! She teaches in what can only be described as a style which I am sure most students would not be able to understand and hardly explains things in an easy to understand language.

A-Vic

Glynis wrote: »

The tutor herself has only been at our college for a month so I don't know how she can mark me as fail because she doesn't have any experience of my other simulations. That is the problem I have with her. I don't like her method of teaching despite her "superior" saying she hasn't received any complaints so far! She teaches in what can only be described as a style which I am sure most students would not be able to understand and hardly explains things in an easy to understand language.

Glynis i dont think it matters if she knows you or not there is a certain level to get for passing anything simulations or exams.

Bluewednesday

A-Vic wrote: »

Glynis i dont think it matters if she knows you or not there is a certain level to get for passing anything simulations or exams.

Exactly - the whole point of a sim is to reach a certain standard regardless of how your other simulations are.

I do believe you have unreaslistic expectations, do any of the other students complain as well?

I thought you were home studying this one

Marg22

Glynis

If you don't get adequate feedback from your tutor and still don't know why you are going wrong. It is worth thinking about doing the personal tax unit as this one is suppose to be the easier of the two. The pass rate in the exams is no were near as high as for the simulations so bear that in mind.

You could easily do this on your own, if you buy the books and ask for help from the very nice people on this forum.

Good luck

Marg

Steve Collings

Glynis wrote: »

The tutor herself has only been at our college for a month so I don't know how she can mark me as fail because she doesn't have any experience of my other simulations. That is the problem I have with her. I don't like her method of teaching despite her "superior" saying she hasn't received any complaints so far! She teaches in what can only be described as a style which I am sure most students would not be able to understand and hardly explains things in an easy to understand language.

Different tutors will have different methods of delivering their lectures and unfortunately not every single student will appreciate a certain way of teaching. In a tutorial environment it is sometimes a physical impossibility to please everyone. You should definitely ask for feedback on your simulation though as this will help you see where things went wrong.

Have you asked your tutor to stay behind after class and clarify some of the issues you have not been able to understand? Does everyone in your class feel the same about her method of teaching?

If you are not able to do another simulation e.g. tax and you feel there is no way forward between you and your tutor, then the only other option would be to switch to another provider and either continue with your IAP studies or switch to another unit.

Regards,

Steve

blobbyh

Glynis wrote: »

The tutor herself has only been at our college for a month so I don't know how she can mark me as fail because she doesn't have any experience of my other simulations.

So you got an impartial opinion - isn't that the correct way? How should your previous assessments have impacted her opinion on this one? Are you implying that had she known you better, your result would have been better, since to me, that only casts doubt on the impartiality of your previous assessors not on your current one?

And if the assessor has had no other complaints, doesn't that mean her teaching style is generally accepted by everyone else apart from yourself and she should adapt just to suit you?

AK002

Glynis wrote: »

The tutor herself has only been at our college for a month so I don't know how she can mark me as fail because she doesn't have any experience of my other simulations. That is the problem I have with her. I don't like her method of teaching despite her "superior" saying she hasn't received any complaints so far! She teaches in what can only be described as a style which I am sure most students would not be able to understand and hardly explains things in an easy to understand language.

The examiner who marks your exams in June & Dec doesn't have experience of your other exams either..

Londina

I will attempt to do a IAP simulation within one month. I'm on distance learning and so far I didnt find the subject difficult.

jorja1986

Glynis wrote: »

The tutor herself has only been at our college for a month so I don't know how she can mark me as fail because she doesn't have any experience of my other simulations. That is the problem I have with her. I don't like her method of teaching despite her "superior" saying she hasn't received any complaints so far! She teaches in what can only be described as a style which I am sure most students would not be able to understand and hardly explains things in an easy to understand language.

Have you spoken with other students? They maybe able to assist you in the issues that you are having on your sim? they may be able to explain what your tutor has taught in a different way?

I have had inexperienced tutors and whilst at the time i was ranting about them i can see that they are learning just as much as the students and until they try techniques out they won't know what works and what doesn't.

Look on the AAT website and get the course guidelines on what is assessed. This will help you to go through and analyse what you wrote and why it differed from who they wanted the answer to be written.

It could be something as simple as you are not using the key words that the assessor is looking for, they would not be doing you any favours if they assumed that what you wrote meant to be the key word. You have to be explicit in showing competancies.

messedup89

Londina wrote: »

I will attempt to do a IAP simulation within one month. I'm on distance learning and so far I didnt find the subject difficult.

We dont have long to do ours. The tuition is on 13th and 14th Jan 2010, then the simm is 1 week later on 22nd!

speegs

Hi Glynis

Where are you studying? Maybe you should consider moving colleges. I studied at BPP and 100% in my IAP mock and was competent first time on my actual sim. BPP London taught me everything I know and they were great.

Best of luck anyway. Chin up girl

Speegs

Glynis

I have had a meeting with my tutor and the department head today who explained in detail were I went wrong. It seems I am not explaining proper procedures or the implications of not doing something.

I mentioned about my tutor teaching style but the department head said that she had sat in on the tutor and student feedback was good so looks like I am going to have to muddle through it with a rubbish teacher!

I so wanted to start ACCA before xmas but looks like I won't be doing.

blobbyh

(Repeatedly thumps own head on table)

AK002

Helps robert thump his head on the table... (With pleasure!)

Glynis

blobbyh wrote: »

(Repeatedly thumps own head on table)

Could I ask why you keep insisting on pouring scorn over certain students on here? Some of us are struggling and need to ask advice and can't always be as good as you obviously are.


If you can't offer me words of advice then I would prefer not to have your opinion!

Greycow

May be it is just a clash with this tutor and you would be better looking at another provider. People have tried to help you with advice, but unless it is what you want to hear you do not seem to accept it.

Glynis

Greycow I have taken all advixe on board and have put in a lot of work. This sim has proved impossible so far and combine that with an immature tutor makes iot even harder.

I have only got to pass this paper then I can do ACCA which I have decided to do with another college.

katsutlieff

Glynis I understand your frustration relating to this subject and it not clicking. It is the only thing stopping you from moving on to what you really what to do. But from what I understand ACCA is a huge step up from the AAT so isn't it worth spending the time focusing on your weaknesses and trying to improve them, before really throwing yourself into the deep end.

I love what I am learning, but like you, when it comes to explaining procedures, and writing information reports I struggle. I know what I want to say, I understand the procedures, but have brain freeze when it comes to writing it down. The only suggestion is take on board what your tutor has said; without taking offence and practice, ask for activities from her to help you improve on this area. If she didn't point out where your weaknesses lie she won't be doing her job properly, and wouldn't be doing you any favours.

Learning to take constructive criticisms and learning from it is one of the most important tools we all have, it's a harsh world out there and employers are not going to mollycoddle you because you dont like the way something has been said to you. I get the impression you need to grow a thicker skin. You have had some great support and advice on these forums in the last few months, you tend to run with the things you like to hear and get aggressive with the comments you dont. The people on these forums cannot take the sim for you but they have held your hand more than alot of other people struggling. Accept the help and support but don't lash out when things aren't necessarily wrapped in cotton wool for you.

Good luck, and I genuinely mean that, this obviously means a lot to you, but I am sure if you put in the hard work you will reap the rewards.

Steve Collings

Hi Glynis,

Katsutlief has given you some excellent advice there.

I don't think Robert is "pouring scorn" over your posts, I just think to a certain extent we're all trying to help you in whatever way we can, but you seem to lash out when you encounter difficulties rather than trying to deal with it in a logical sense.

Audit is an extremely technical subject with some jargon thrown in which you won't encounter in any other financial paper (substantive testing/anomalous errors etc). If you can incorporate these technical terms in an answer to "beef up" your solution then this will undoubtedly help you succeed. I have given you links to all sorts of auditing articles I have published out there for students, one of which shows you how to answer an auditing question. Granted this is aimed at ACCA students but the concept is still the same whatever level of auditing you are studying.

Your tutor is there to help you and you have said you are studying ACCA with a different provider when you get through IAP. ACCA exams are a lot harder and certainly F8 (Audit & Assurance) brings with it a whole load of more advanced technical stuff you need to learn (I'm being completely honest with you - ACCA exams are not a walk in the park). I am not in the business of patronising students because I deal with struggling students almost daily in my work but I would implore you to try and deal with difficult situations more calmly and by chipping away at problematic areas in a more structured way (you did jump in feet first when you first started IAP) because you ARE going to get papers at ACCA that you will not be comfortable with - everybody does, but by dealing with them calmly and listening to tutors who, at the end of the day, are there and are being paid to help you, you will get through.

Good luck.

Regards

Steve

AK002

2 very good and very true posts there. I'd take those 2 on board.