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I have had a recent experience where my age was mentioned. I currently work in industry and I had an informal chat with an audit manager of an accountancy firm about possibly moving into audit and studying ACCA. While I was made aware it would involve starting in a junior role, which I was expecting and absolutely fine with, he did make a comment that I wasn’t expecting. He told me that at 28 years of age I was a ‘little bit old’ to be starting off in audit. I was completely taken aback. I had a career change when I was 25 and moved into finance. I studied my AAT and progressed within the company I was working for, but felt I wanted to expand my knowledge and qualifications. Never once has my age been an issue. I was so offended by his comment. It wasn’t like I was complaining about starting at the bottom and saying my age should entitle me to a higher role. I had stated that I accepted I would need to start from the bottom and prove myself. The point I’m trying to make Glynis is that age plays no factor in the grade of job you get. Despite being 28 and AAT qualified I would need to start in a junior role in audit as I have no experience whatsoever in that area. I sympathise with your feelings about your age as it is an awful feeling when people see it as a bad thing and you feel like it’s stopping you achieving your goals. However you just have to forget any reference people make to your age (some people just don’t think about what they are saying) and remember that no matter what age you are if you’re starting in a new area you have to start at the bottom. One the plus side use your experience and knowledge to prove how good you can be, you’ll be able to progress quicker than you think.
Sorry this is so long, ha ha.
I can well remember my days as an audit junior and however desperate I was for work I don't think there's anyway I could ever return to that voluntarily. It is a soul destroying job, even more so if you've been used to working independantly with some autonomy over your work. Hours and hours spent hanging around waiting for the senior to tell me which invoice I had to go and find to photocopy. Days spent writing out blank working papers ready for the audit (although I guess this is all done by computer now). More days spent in the filing room filing letters. Ticking bank accounts and then not even having the satisfaction of doing the bank rec at the end, oh no, the senior got to do the fun bit. If you've only got 10 years of working life left then you've got to ask yourself why bother putting yourself through all that misery. By the time you were starting to get anywhere you'd be close to retirement age.0 -
Nice post Jacalina, apart from a couple of things I don't necessarily agree with.
I appreciate that some agencies may advertsie "phantom vacancies" however this could be for several reasons.
1) The agency may periodically get more than one position of the same type and so runs a 'standing' advert in a local newspaper or on their website. Some general, mass market agencies may focus more on lower level positions which are clearly more common than niche poisitons which only crop up very rarely. From time to time they crop up and are duly filled.
2) Agencies spend a great deal of money on advertising so it's hardly likely to be money wasted if it's not going to reap them some dividends, especially in this age of cut backs.
3) Agencies cannot guarantee a job for everyone - we are not the job centre. Clients pay us to filter out the unsuitable people which is what we do and it's up to each candidate to bring themselves up to the required standards, not the job of the agencies to lower theirs. And just like any other trade, repeat business means what we do we do well.
As for the age thing, well clearly it's a tricky topic since one day it will affect us all. However we live in a real world and some bosses will always look at someone's age when deciding risk and whether to invest time and money into that particular person. Like it or not - and I imagine this will perhaps be a practice accountancy consideration, albeit an unwritten one - that someone nearing retirement age may not payback the investment as quickly as someone who can provide economic benefits for decades to come or if at all.
I'm not saying age prejudice is right or fair but it's blind to ignore that it happens, especially when we're expecting others to make that financial risk and investment not ourselves.0 -
A Little old at 28 lord am stuffed0
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BlobbyH - You make some very valid points about agencies. I was in no way trying to have a go at them, I think generally they do a very good job. I’ve had a temp job and a permanent job in the past through agencies. My most recent experience with one was positive also. So from my point of view they have been extremely helpful. I just think that like with anything, there are always some exceptions and I can understand people getting frustrated about the ‘phantom job’ situation, myself included. You are most likely right and they aren’t doing it on purpose. After all they are probably inundated with cv’s and people begging them to find them a job, so I suppose they don’t need to try to coax people onto their books. But I’m sure you can see why people feel the way they do.
I didn’t end up pursuing the audit route after all. My chat with the audit manager and some audit staff made me realise it wasn’t the right type of job for me. I’m not actually sure I would have been ‘discriminated’ against as such because of my age, he did say I was welcome to come back for a formal interview with him and another audit manager if I wanted. Whether I would have got a job, I’m not sure. I just think that it was a bit unfair to say I was a bit old. In my view 28 is still very young and if they did take me on and I passed my exams first time I would have been fully qualified by the time I was 31. They would have had plenty of years out of me! I think most people they have who apply for this type of role come straight from uni so are probably around 21 years old. But the attitude I got basically means that if you don’t start in accountancy straightaway you’re too old and you’re not allowed to have a change in career to accountancy later in life. And let’s face it, at 21 years old there is a chance you haven’t totally decided what you want to do.
On the good side I decided to stick with the job I had and I asked to get more involved with new things to broaden my horizons. My manager was really pleased I was keen to up my game and as a result I’m really enjoying my job now. Every cloud has a silver lining I guess.0 -
BlobbyH - You make some very valid points about agencies. I was in no way trying to have a go at them, I think generally they do a very good job. I’ve had a temp job and a permanent job in the past through agencies. My most recent experience with one was positive also. So from my point of view they have been extremely helpful. I just think that like with anything, there are always some exceptions and I can understand people getting frustrated about the ‘phantom job’ situation, myself included. You are most likely right and they aren’t doing it on purpose. After all they are probably inundated with cv’s and people begging them to find them a job, so I suppose they don’t need to try to coax people onto their books. But I’m sure you can see why people feel the way they do.
I didn’t end up pursuing the audit route after all. My chat with the audit manager and some audit staff made me realise it wasn’t the right type of job for me. I’m not actually sure I would have been ‘discriminated’ against as such because of my age, he did say I was welcome to come back for a formal interview with him and another audit manager if I wanted. Whether I would have got a job, I’m not sure. I just think that it was a bit unfair to say I was a bit old. In my view 28 is still very young and if they did take me on and I passed my exams first time I would have been fully qualified by the time I was 31. They would have had plenty of years out of me! I think most people they have who apply for this type of role come straight from uni so are probably around 21 years old. But the attitude I got basically means that if you don’t start in accountancy straightaway you’re too old and you’re not allowed to have a change in career to accountancy later in life. And let’s face it, at 21 years old there is a chance you haven’t totally decided what you want to do.
On the good side I decided to stick with the job I had and I asked to get more involved with new things to broaden my horizons. My manager was really pleased I was keen to up my game and as a result I’m really enjoying my job now. Every cloud has a silver lining I guess.
i'm 21 and definatly know what i want to do with my life! i'm finishing the AAT, got married last year and own my own little flat. i've been with my company for 3 years next month and wouldn't change a thing. it is me and one other person (my manager) in the accounts department of a folding door company. She goes on honeymoon next month so i am left to run the shop.
Neither of us went to uni as we felt its more benificial to get experience first and study while working. we have also noticed that when peole go to uni they pick courses they like the idea of but don't really think where it will take them (since when has bio chemistry helped to sell doors- but thats what two of my sales team have got degrees in). so chances are if you did change to auditing it wouldn't be graduates you were up against.
changing jobs is all about how you come across to the people interviewing you. My company advertised for someone with experience but i emailed them anyway. they took me on there and then at my first interview (i had had many interviews so when i saw a job i was applying regardless as was getting desperate) at the time i was taken on i hadn't even received my a levels results (probably a good thing, esp with the accounting one, but my teacher was asleep most of the time). just shows you need to come across in a positive way0 -
i'm 21 and definatly know what i want to do with my life!
Agreed! I am 21 today and I'm doing exactly what I want to do with my life and will continue to do so. For a 21 year old (or any age for that matter) to enter a career in accountancy I'd imagine they would have thought about it pretty hard and wouldn't be doing it light-heartedly.0 -
Happy Birthday Gem! I've just turned 22 and i'm doing what I want with my life so I think some people do know what they want at a young age. I'm AAT and ACCA qualified and starting a new job at the start of August, can't wait! Even though i have lots of study fees to pay back i know its the right move for me
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I really feel like my comment about people who are 21 not necessarily knowing what they want to do is being taken the wrong way. I’m not saying that everyone at that age and younger doesn’t know what they want as a career, I’m just saying that not everyone does. Plenty of my friends and family have left education knowing exactly what they want and are still happily progressing in the same career. If you can do that and be happy then brilliant. I’m just saying that for some people it’s not that easy. I know many people, myself included, who have left education with a career in mind, only to find out that either it’s not right for them, they can’t get a job doing it or they still aren’t sure exactly what they want to spend the next 40 years of their life doing.
It was by accident that I realised I wanted a career in finance. In a previous job I ended up having some involvement in the finance side of the business and after spending more and more time doing it I realised that’s what I wanted to do as a career. After that I got a new job and studied for my AAT, deciding if I was going to make a career out of it I was going to put the effort in and get the relevant qualifications too. If someone had told me a few years before that I would want to be an accountant I would never have believed them as it had never been a career I’d considered before.
All I was doing was sharing an experience where I was made to feel awkward because I hadn’t decided on a career in accounting at a younger age. I was trying to make the point that not everyone has decided on their career when they are fresh from education and that some people need to spend a bit of time in the working world before they realise what they want to do.
I really hope I didn’t offend anyone, that really wasn’t my intention.0 -
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I really hope I didn’t offend anyone, that really wasn’t my intention.
You haven't offended anyone, we're not that touchy on here save for a notorious one or two!
Blimey, just drag Dean S back here (once he's out of the oxygen tent) and he'll show you what good offensiveness is...0
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