fall out with auditors

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Comments

  • A-VicA-Vic Expertise Guaranteed Posts: 6,970Registered
    C2XVT wrote: »
    Why the hostility towards Glynis?

    If you dont like what she's posting, there is a X on the top right of your screen that you can press anytime.

    Nobody is holding a gun to your head making you read and reply her posts.

    Well firstly go find her posts in the past i have defended her not unlike yourself, but then when she talks to people the way she does and makes herself a victim of her own posts she brings it on herself. She brings in her stresses from her supposed job to which i am starting to think she has made it all up just as attention seeking.

    Finally any new posters that feel the need to ask questions may read her posts and be put off- also she isnt a student of aat anymore so why does she even post on student forums (if you look again).
  • slackdaslackda Trusted Regular Posts: 460Registered
    well, this is interesting little scenario thats going on.

    just got back from a short break to see this on the forums.

    looking over a few of glynis' posts particularly the ones to steve, i would have to agree with others posts, i understand the problem of auditors, having had to deal with a internal audit and external audit at the same time and having to do the audit for our main company whilst doing the audit for a joint venture, i know it can be very stressful, but i think that the basics have been covered by the other members, communication is key in any job role, so be prepared you might get a slap on the wrist for the way you behaved towards the auditors, assuming that they have actually just walked out in disgust rather than just leaving cos they have what they need for now ( all of ours had a bad habit of just walking out when they had what they needed).

    So of the questions i have seen you post, do question what the AAT is now examining ( i studied and passed over 3 years ago now). e.g why does a company need a cash flow forecast thread, i was under the impression that the AAT taught about the framework and reporting requirements surely this was covered in the course? i know for sure that a Cash flow statement was in the exam i took, ( in know cos i bloody hate them).

    I Also suggest that you keep the FAO Steve threads to PM, at the end of the day he is going to see them as soon as he logs in. If some thing that is of use to other student members arises from the pm's fee free to then post the basics of the converstation on the forum for others to read, rather than what seems to be spam requests for help.

    This isn't a digg at you personally, but please please take on board waht others have said as constructive critism. Dust off your self and get ready for the week ahead.
  • NeilHNeilH Trusted Regular Posts: 547Registered
    Glynis wrote: »
    @steve
    So it is ok for them to come in, harrass and make demands of me and then expect me to deal with my job, everyday enquiries, month end and my boss's demands.

    Shocking really isnt it! I don't know how I cope when they come in pre and post year end whilst I'm still dealing with said year end!
  • James CristianoJames Cristiano AAT Web Team Posts: 48Unregistered / Not Logged In
    Elements of this thread...

    Dear AAT forum users

    It has been brought to our attention that elements of this thread has offended at least one of our users.

    Can i please ask that the general tone of this thread be 'mellowed down', so to speak, otherwise we shall have to remove it.

    Please remember, different people have different thresholds of what they would consider to be offensive. If in doubt, please 'go without'!

    Kind Regards,
    James, AAT Web Team
  • DiannewDiannew Font Of All Knowledge Posts: 2,814Registered
    As much as I am very sympathetic to forum friends that have issue's that require help from us all and those of you that supply the help are really "one in a million" and really care...you are wonderful people believe me you have helped me personally.


    Do you not think YOU are all being taken for a bit of a RIDE here.....and being drawn into a game which could end up with YOU being worse off or even banned................looking at the content's of all the other post's involving this person it appears that no amount of help or remarks are doing any good, if infact a problem does exist.

    I would take care and seriously think about it.

    Take Care
    Di xx
  • burgburg Experienced Mentor GloucesterPosts: 1,440Moderator, FMAAT, AAT Licensed Accountant
    Echo James & Dianne

    I think we all know how obstructing an audit can have it's consequences.

    Most of us have had criticism and pointed out the problems associated with the situation and now it is up to the OP to maybe look back over the situation and decide her course of action.

    She can then learn to take responsibility for her own actions.

    Generally we are a good bunch who do give quality advice each in our own ways. I think getting a broad spectrum of opinions in different manners is a way of making your own mind up on the situation. I am sure we will all continue to contribute to people in the ways we always have done. I am sure in asking questions to people it is correct to get the full view of the target audience? If only those viewing the positive were putting their points of view forward the OP would not be given the full view of the situation they are facing! Also I think many would not ask questions if they only got a one sided answer!

    Maybe some of us do need to be more diplomatic in the way we approach our answers. On the other and judging the tone of someone's response on a forum is much harder than that of a verbal conversation.

    Best of luck to the OP in the way she takes the situation forward and maybe something can be salvaged from the situation.
    Regards,

    Burg
  • MILLY21MILLY21 Feels At Home Posts: 59Registered
    Hi Glynis

    I would be interested to hear how you got on with your boss and the auditors today.

    To use my own experience, I generally tend to get together as much information as possible before the auditos arrive, pop them in a quite and private part of the office and on arrival, give them all the hard copies of items they require.

    If im going to be having a busy day I let them know, just in case there is something I need to provide them with so they can get along with their job.

    I am suprised they kept suggesting thing along the way but if they do, ask them to jot their points down and maybe arrange to discuss these points with them. No business is the same so perhaps in doing this they can explain their suggestions and you can provide the reason why you do it in your way. I have been in this siutation when an auditor has made a recommendation and I have explained how and why things are done a certain way, they then have been more than satisfied and make a note for the next years audit so we dont go over old ground.

    I've alway worked with the auditos beacuse they have a lot of knowledge that can be very helpfull and an over coffee chat has always been good for free advise!!!

    Everyones personalities are different and if they were in a bus queue we may clash with them. Try and stay calm in future and unless its our company, we really arn't in any position to lose our cool - easier said than done in all things I know but this is particularly imporortant. Im sure you have had to keep your cool with a troublesome boss in the past so try the old count to ten approach.


    I think if we looked at it from an auditors perspective, I guess they get frustrated at having to ask for information all the time and to deal - at times with diferent clinets hostilities to the whole auditing experience , I dont think any of us would ask for an audit due to the stress!!!

    If you can, try not to concentrate of people's age. I would be most offended it at 30 something, our auditors (in their 20's) considered me to be old and stuck in my ways and thats when I return to the professional courtesy/respect bit.

    lets hope you can overcome this incident and move forward.

    Good luck
  • PoodlePoodle Experienced Mentor Posts: 711Registered
    Hi Glynis

    Firstly, I am really surprised that your boss is away when the auditors are in. I have never conducted an audit but I have been involved with audits being carried out where I had been employed and in charge of accounts.

    Always audits were pre-planned several months in advance, normally at about the same time each year so that everyone knew, and "no one" involved with finance or director in charge of finance was allowed leave at that time. Also our auditors were always willing to negotiate the audit time so that it that did not interferre with a busy time in the office. That is just down to common sense planning.

    Everyone knows that auditors need to have access to and will ask information about how work is carried out. I have never know them to swoop down and ask questions on the spot expecting answers there and then. Normally it goes along the lines of the auditor asking to spend some time with the PL clerk or PC clerk later that day or the next day, with a list of questions.

    Also, I have never had an auditor tell me what I should or should not be doing or how certain procedures should be conducted as an audit is in actual progress. Anything like that has always gone into the letter to management, discussed and actioned, or not, at a later date.

    Sorry, that you and the auditors are having such a bad experience with this.

    Regarding age, well, I see my doctor getting younger every time I visit him, and that gives me a problem, not a young auditor :0
  • deanshepherddeanshepherd Font Of All Knowledge Posts: 1,809Registered
    I find the following quite helpful when you have auditors in:

    1. Give them their own room to work from.
    2. Turn the heating off in that room.
    3. Make sure that room is furthest away from the photocopier.
    4. and preferably with no plug socket.
    5. Make sure the telephone in that room rings on every incoming call.

    A couple of fire drills also liven up the day..
  • RinskeRinske Font Of All Knowledge Posts: 2,453Registered
    I find the following quite helpful when you have auditors in:

    1. Give them their own room to work from.
    2. Turn the heating off in that room.
    3. Make sure that room is furthest away from the photocopier.
    4. and preferably with no plug socket.
    5. Make sure the telephone in that room rings on every incoming call.

    A couple of fire drills also liven up the day..
    Haha, that's just being evil!

    Although we had the same issue here 2 years ago, only not intentional, we gave them a room with only one socket, no heating in the room and only half the lights worked. Last year they used the office of our manager as he was in meetings all the time anyways.

    One small room with one desk, 5 auditors trying to find a space to work on it with laptops, there was not enough room for 5 chairs, so most of the time 3 were standing. The moment they closed the door there was no heating available, the phone was actually forwarded, so at least they didn't get any ringing, but on the other hand, there is absolutely no reception with their mobile phones here, so for calls they had to step outside the office completely...

    This year we got a serious lack of space again, so not sure where they will have to sit.
  • JanJan Experienced Mentor Posts: 654Registered
    Diane, I think you might have a point there.
  • BluewednesdayBluewednesday Font Of All Knowledge Posts: 1,624Registered
    Am still awaiting the outcome though
  • AK002AK002 Font Of All Knowledge Posts: 2,492Registered
    Jan wrote: »
    Diane, I think you might have a point there.

    First time for everything!!!
  • DiannewDiannew Font Of All Knowledge Posts: 2,814Registered
    AK002 wrote: »
    First time for everything!!!

    Excuse me!!! trouble...LOL

    Look over all the posts....I think you will find I am right.................x
  • blobbyhblobbyh Font Of All Knowledge Posts: 2,415Registered
    There's no-one I've known on here for the past four years who'd be so disrespectful to Steve, Sandy and Annette by getting them to waste their valuable time on a wind-up. Toadface, even today, still has a grudge to bear - as some of us know - but even Glynis isn't that crazy! I know she sounds a but OTT but I do think she's a real person, just one that's hopelessly out of her depth and refuses to realise it!

    As for banning, you'd have to do something seriously extreme to become a member of that very exclusive club and I can only think of two others who ever have - Data Input Officer and Repeaters - and I don't think Glynis is them either!
  • GlynisGlynis Trusted Regular Posts: 488Registered
    I wish ny situation was a wind up! I had a very long talk with my boss about the issue last week. The auditors have actually done what they needed to but I am now on leave for stress.

    Thankyou to those that made positive contributions, especially steve and Sandy.
  • DiannewDiannew Font Of All Knowledge Posts: 2,814Registered
    blobbyh wrote: »
    There's no-one I've known on here for the past four years who'd be so disrespectful to Steve, Sandy and Annette by getting them to waste their valuable time on a wind-up. Toadface, even today, still has a grudge to bear - as some of us know - but even Glynis isn't that crazy! I know she sounds a but OTT but I do think she's a real person, just one that's hopelessly out of her depth and refuses to realise it!

    As for banning, you'd have to do something seriously extreme to become a member of that very exclusive club and I can only think of two others who ever have - Data Input Officer and Repeaters - and I don't think Glynis is them either!

    Point taken Robert......but I was refering to the people who where responding to the posts and getting a bit angry (understandable) my concern was that they may end up getting banned as quite rightly admin had made a post on the thread for all to calm down.....

    Hopefully this has now run it's course and it can be put to bed.....
  • JanJan Experienced Mentor Posts: 654Registered
    In that case Glynis we wish you well, hopefully you will return to work soon, refreshed and ready to face anything.
  • RinskeRinske Font Of All Knowledge Posts: 2,453Registered
    Jan wrote: »
    In that case Glynis we wish you well, hopefully you will return to work soon, refreshed and ready to face anything.
    Nicely said, so I'm just joining in on that if Jan doesn't mind.

    I do hope you will return to work soon and be ready to face anything!
  • A-VicA-Vic Expertise Guaranteed Posts: 6,970Registered
    Glynis wrote: »
    I wish ny situation was a wind up! I had a very long talk with my boss about the issue last week. The auditors have actually done what they needed to but I am now on leave for stress.

    Thankyou to those that made positive contributions, especially steve and Sandy.

    So you spoke to them last week? but didnt you say you fell out with them on friday and was waiting to speak to your boss yesterday not that you spoke to them last week? o well whatever goodluck enjoy the rest
  • coojeecoojee Experienced Mentor Posts: 794Registered
    I find the following quite helpful when you have auditors in:

    1. Give them their own room to work from.
    2. Turn the heating off in that room.
    3. Make sure that room is furthest away from the photocopier.
    4. and preferably with no plug socket.
    5. Make sure the telephone in that room rings on every incoming call.

    A couple of fire drills also liven up the day..

    Ah Dean, I take you've never been an auditor? When I was auditing we had a unwritten list of "best" and "worst" clients. This was purely based on what kind of room they gave us, whether they made us plenty of cups of coffee or gave us free access to the kitchen to make our own, how near the photocopier was etc etc. The higher up the list, the nicer we were to them. Stands to reason really, if the client treats you will then you treat them well back. So overall, if you treat your auditor well during the visit they'll be finished quicker and they'll be nicer to you while they're there. Make their life difficult and they'll take longer, not out of spite just purely because you've been so awkward it takes them longer to get everything done. Consider the photocopier - they have to copy hundreds of documents - make it a long way away and they have to walk further to get to it so it takes them longer. Don't give them a desk to sit at, it takes them longer to write up what they need to write up. Do you see what I mean?

    As for the OP (and I don't know whether I even dare go there) Auditors tend to have to ask more questions when the accounting system is badly run. If the system works as documented then they'll be able to find things as and when they need them. If files are all over the place and things aren't filed where they should be etc then they will be comstantly mithering. So to anyone who complains that their auditor is asking them too many questions then you need only look to yourself. If things don't reconcile then you've made a mistake and it needs pointing out. If you want to save time at the audit, make sure everything DOES reconcile, it's a simple thing to do really to ensure that everything is in order for the auditors. I've come across a fair few accounts staff in my time who thought that cos they'd worked their for 300 hundred years it meant they were brilliant at their job and that no one had the right to question them about it.
  • JanJan Experienced Mentor Posts: 654Registered
    Diannew wrote: »
    Hopefully this has now run it's course and it can be put to bed.....

    I think Glynis has all the advice she needs now and is taking on board all that has been said, hopefully now there is less panic, in the right frame of mind.

    A-Vic, Glynis means she spoke to her boss yesterday, about the issues from last week!
  • A-VicA-Vic Expertise Guaranteed Posts: 6,970Registered
    Jan wrote: »
    I think Glynis has all the advice she needs now and is taking on board all that has been said, hopefully now there is less panic, in the right frame of mind.

    A-Vic, Glynis means she spoke to her boss yesterday, about the issues from last week!

    ooooo right sorry mis-read thanks jan
  • troytroy Trusted Regular Posts: 275Registered
    My auditor finished today, and I have to say I am shocked at all your negative view points on them. I was really nice to mine, we have an open plan office so they were in the same room as us. When they asked me a question, I overloaded them with info, not only providing them with what they wanted, but loads more too! I even printed everything off for them, stappled it together and put headings on everythin!

    Of course this is my first audit, so if they slate me, I will have the laxative tablets ready for them the next time they come back! (only joking....honest)

    Sorry to hear you are off work with stress Glynis, I do hope you soon start to feel better soon.
  • Hasan.AhmetHasan.Ahmet Feels At Home Posts: 87Registered
    Auditors' duties, responsibilities and authority is in the company law.
    They appply the guidelines of the APB as to how they should go about it.
    Their job in the end is to express true and fair view opinion.
    Your employer pays for their time.
    The rest is how people conduct themselves on person to person basis.
  • troytroy Trusted Regular Posts: 275Registered
    Auditors' duties, responsibilities and authority is in the company law.
    They appply the guidelines of the APB as to how they should go about it.
    Their job in the end is to express true and fair view opinion.
    Your employer pays for their time.
    The rest is how people conduct themselves on person to person basis.

    Yes, thank you for the informative view.

    I know they are there to do a job, if they do pick holes in the way I do things I know it is nothing personal.

    And I was only joking about the laxatives in their coffee.........
  • Hasan.AhmetHasan.Ahmet Feels At Home Posts: 87Registered
    I hope the message came across as was intended.
    They shouldn't be picking up holes in the way that you do things.
    How you do your job shouldn't be their concern unless of'course it results for them in material difficulties or differences in expressing true and fair view which I doubt can be the case. That's the statutory audit.
    If they're internal auditors or systems auditors their terms of engagement may be different.

    Best Regards.
  • RowanBRowanB Well-Known Posts: 158Registered
    Oh dear. Another prime example of Blobby throwing his weight about, implementing his bullying tactics and inciting animosity towards a certain individual.

    Don't worry Glynis. It's not just you that has been a victim of this. I have too.
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